On January 6th, as violent insurrectionists breached the building he was charged with protecting, then-Capitol Police Chief Steven Sund placed a “frantic phone call” to the head of the D.C. National Guard. The message was clear and emotional: we need your help.

Yet, members of The Guard didn’t arrive for another three and a half hours. Why the delay?

That’s the question at the center of a joint hearing of the Senate Homeland Security Committee and the Senate Rules Committee (watch above).

On Wednesday, Maj. Gen. William J. Walker, the commanding general of the D.C. National Guard, told lawmakers that he wanted to respond to Sund’s request immediately, but he was hamstrung by a memo the Pentagon sent the day before the Capitol Insurrection. This memo, Gen. Walker explained, required him to seek approval from the Secretary of the Army and the Secretary of Defense before preparing troops to respond to a civil disturbance. Gen. Walker said he sought this approval immediately, but didn’t get authorization until three hours and nineteen minutes later. By then his troops were ready to deploy. They arrived at the Capitol within minutes.

But Gen. Walker’s version of events conflicts with the testimony of Robert Salesses, an assistant secretary of defense. Salesses insists that approval from Pentagon leadership came earlier in the day and it simply took time to communicate the decision and plan the military response.

Whatever the case, Gen. Walker expressed frustration that his troops were unable to assist earlier, “We could have helped extend the perimeter and helped push back the crowd.” Gen. Walker added:

I was sickened by the violence and destruction I witnessed that fateful day and the physical and mental harm that came to the U.S. Capitol Police officers and MPD, some of whom I met with later that evening and I could see the injuries they sustained.

Curiously, the policy that required the Pentagon to approve the D.C. National Guard’s involvement in civil disturbances was not in effect over the summer when hundreds were arrested at demonstrations following the murder of George Floyd.

Gen. Walker testified that the policy and subsequent delay on January 6th stemmed from a concern about optics,“The Army senior leaders did not think it looked good” to have armed guardsmen in front of the Capitol, Walker said, describing a phone call he had with the Pentagon the day of the insurrection. “They further thought it would incite the crowd.” On that phone call, according to Gen. Walker, was Lt. Gen. Charles Flynn, the brother of former national security adviser and Trump loyalist Michael Flynn.

Under questioning, Salesses told Rules Chair Sen. Amy Klobuchar that “optics” did not factor into decision making that day.

Gen. Walker and Assistant Secretary of Defense Salesses were among several experts testifying on Wednesday. Jill Sanborn, from the FBI’s counterterrorism division, told the hearing that there is a “persistent and evolving” threat from an from anti-government, anti-authority and white supremacist actors. She expressed specific concern about potential lone actors, who are hard to identify before they strike.

On Tuesday, in a similar hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee, FBI Director Christopher Wray called the January 6th attack “domestic terrorism.” While he defended the FBI’s intelligence gathering, he admitted the deadly attack was not an “acceptable result.”